SHADOW CHRONICLES: PROFIT AND COST?

  • Posts: 4616
  • Thank you received: 95

Replied by MEMO1DOMINION on topic Re: SHADOW CHRONICLES: PROFIT AND COST?

Gubaba wrote:

Memo...why do you say "SPECULATING" as though it invalidates the arguments,

IT'S THEIR OPINION. NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT.

when you have an ENTIRE PODCAST which contains nothing but speculation? Mav works from unconfirmed reports, too...why do you never call him on it?

THERE IS A THREAD FOR THAT.
"IF IT DOESN'T EXIST...BUILD IT"
Last edit: 9 years 1 month ago by MEMO1DOMINION.
9 years 1 month ago #16240

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • rtsurfer
  • rtsurfer's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • REF Member
  • REF Member
  • Posts: 543
  • Thank you received: 0

Replied by rtsurfer on topic Re: SHADOW CHRONICLES: PROFIT AND COST?

There is a similar discussion going on in the HG/Robotech thread at MW, some interesting comments from Tom Bateman whom is a former employee of HG and worked on Shadow Chronicles with Tommy Yune:

Tom Bateman on May 13, 2011 @ 12:35 PM
Yes, Shadow Chronicles was a financial success and it did very well as there was an interest in seeing ANY new Robotech after over 20 years. Just the fact that there was ANY new Robotech guaranteed a certain amount of success, no matter how good it actually was (i.e. The Phantom Menace). To keep beating your chest about that most simplistic of facts incessantly for the past four years has just gotten OLD. It's like a broken record to hear Kevin repeat this over, and over, and over, and over in front of any audience that will listen to him blather on about how healthy the Robotech franchise is, despite the tough economy. It's total bull---t.

What hasn't been mentioned by HG's marketing genius, is all the LOST revenue from any follow-ups that should have capitalized on the success of RTSC. We are talking MILLIONS of dollars that could have been made via home video, merchandising and video games.

Kevin fashions himself a master of "spin". The few people who actually attend his panels may buy it, but even the hardcore fans have mostly left Robotech for other franchises. Fond memories of a once great franchise? Yes. Hope for the future? No.

This is where Tommy, Steve and Kevin have egregiously FAILED as employees of Frank Agrama and Harmony Gold. They simply don't make HG a lot of money and they continue to fail every day. I don't even see how they justify their own paychecks, which combined are probably about $150,000 a year (just guessing). They'd better hope nobody checks.

"rtsurfer's two cent..." ;O)

rtsurfer's ROBOTECH archive
9 years 1 month ago #16247

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • rtsurfer
  • rtsurfer's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • REF Member
  • REF Member
  • Posts: 543
  • Thank you received: 0

Replied by rtsurfer on topic Re: SHADOW CHRONICLES: PROFIT AND COST?

MEMO1DOMINION wrote:

CORRECT. EVEN RICHARD EPCAR AFFIRM THAT THROUGH A CON ABOUT SIGNING ON TO 3 OTHER MOVIES BUT SCRAPPED AFTER THE WB DEAL.

What exactly did Richard Epcar say about the future of the other 3 SC saga movies, and what did he mean by "scrapped"?
"rtsurfer's two cent..." ;O)

rtsurfer's ROBOTECH archive
9 years 1 month ago #16249

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • rtsurfer
  • rtsurfer's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • REF Member
  • REF Member
  • Posts: 543
  • Thank you received: 0

Replied by rtsurfer on topic Re: SHADOW CHRONICLES: PROFIT AND COST?

zen72, the thing is that all movies and series have errors and flubs. Even the ones who try really hard to get it right slip up from time to time. In SCs case it goes beyond just mistakes and oversights, for example look at how badly the mecha and ships are generated, blended, and move. etc.
This was HG's big chance to revive the franchise, they should have taken full advantage of the first significant Robotech in over twenty years. This was there chance to not only grab the hardcore fans but the curious anime buffs and especially the casual fans, some who probably haven't thought about Robotech in 10 or 20 years. Do they do the very best to make sure its a flawless film and experience that will make all of these fans come back again for more with their family and friends in tow... Nope, they phone it in, and it becomes just another sloppy, low budget movie with crappy cgi and careless mistakes.
"rtsurfer's two cent..." ;O)

rtsurfer's ROBOTECH archive
9 years 1 month ago #16250

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • ps99041
  • Visitor
  • Visitor

Replied by ps99041 on topic Re: SHADOW CHRONICLES: PROFIT AND COST?

rtsurfer wrote:

MEMO1DOMINION wrote:

CORRECT. EVEN RICHARD EPCAR AFFIRM THAT THROUGH A CON ABOUT SIGNING ON TO 3 OTHER MOVIES BUT SCRAPPED AFTER THE WB DEAL.

What exactly did Richard Epcar say about the future of the other 3 SC saga movies, and what did he mean by "scrapped"?

I guess we'll never get a real response to this question. It'd be nice if someone could post this question over at rt.com and see what the response is - probably an immediate ban followed by hearing how HG is fully committed to Robotech, there's sidequel coming, and LAM and SR in development.

I am curious though about how much revenue could have been generated for HG if they had actually milked the success of SC with more merchandise (I know the wallet must be selling gangbusters) and a direct sequel as originally planned before the LAM deal. I guess interest may have been too low with Robotech at the time of SC for them to convince anyone to produce merchandise though we're in the situation today despite Robotech's popularity "rising" from the con tour.

Regarding the triumvirate's total pay - if it's true that would explain why they haven't been fired despite any progress on the franchise. No one else would be willing to work for so little. :P
9 years 1 month ago #16251

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • Posts: 4616
  • Thank you received: 95

Replied by MEMO1DOMINION on topic Re: SHADOW CHRONICLES: PROFIT AND COST?

rtsurfer wrote:

There is a similar discussion going on in the HG/Robotech thread at MW, some interesting comments from Tom Bateman whom is a former employee of HG and worked on Shadow Chronicles with Tommy Yune:

Tom Bateman on May 13, 2011 @ 12:35 PM
Yes, Shadow Chronicles was a financial success and it did very well as there was an interest in seeing ANY new Robotech after over 20 years. Just the fact that there was ANY new Robotech guaranteed a certain amount of success, no matter how good it actually was (i.e. The Phantom Menace). To keep beating your chest about that most simplistic of facts incessantly for the past four years has just gotten OLD. It's like a broken record to hear Kevin repeat this over, and over, and over, and over in front of any audience that will listen to him blather on about how healthy the Robotech franchise is, despite the tough economy. It's total bull---t.

What hasn't been mentioned by HG's marketing genius, is all the LOST revenue from any follow-ups that should have capitalized on the success of RTSC. We are talking MILLIONS of dollars that could have been made via home video, merchandising and video games.

Kevin fashions himself a master of "spin". The few people who actually attend his panels may buy it, but even the hardcore fans have mostly left Robotech for other franchises. Fond memories of a once great franchise? Yes. Hope for the future? No.

This is where Tommy, Steve and Kevin have egregiously FAILED as employees of Frank Agrama and Harmony Gold. They simply don't make HG a lot of money and they continue to fail every day. I don't even see how they justify their own paychecks, which combined are probably about $150,000 a year (just guessing). They'd better hope nobody checks.


A FIRED, DISGRUNTLED EX EMPLOYEE OF HG WITH A RANT SO BIG HE WOULD GO TO ANYONE WHO WILL LISTEN... AND HE WENT TO DOUGH BENDO PODCAST FIRST... YEP, A GOOD RANT THERE.

I KEEP HEARING ABOUT HOW BAD IT IS BUT CAN'T SHOW THE NUMBERS. REMEMBER HE GOT CANNED BY AGRAMA HIMSELF BEFORE THERE WAS A DEAL WITH WB. IF YOU THROWING HIS NAME AROUND AS SOURCE, AT LEAST WITH BACK UP WHERE THE BS IS.

NOTHING NEW THAN WHAT WE ALREADY KNOW. AT LEAST YOU HAVE AN IDEA OF HOW BIG SHADOW CHRONICLES WAS AT THE TIME OF RELEASE. AND LOT OF OPINION OF HIS LIKE ANY FAN OUT THERE ABOUT HG.

AND YOU GUYS HAVE BETTER ARGUMENTS. HECK, EVEN RICHARD PUTS UP GOOD QUESTIONS. BUT TO BAD THE ANSWERS COMES WITH RANTS.



TOM MIGHT RANT AND BLAME TOMMY OR KEV. BUT REMEMBER THAT FRANK AGRAMA, THE ONE WHO FIRED TOM, IS THE ONE IN CHARGE AND CALLING THE SHOTS.

SO IF YOU WANT TO BELIEVE IT WAS ALL TOMMY'S DOING THEN GO AHEAD. HE COULD SUE FOR WRONGFUL TERMINATION IF THAT WAS THE CASE.
"IF IT DOESN'T EXIST...BUILD IT"
Last edit: 9 years 1 month ago by MEMO1DOMINION.
9 years 1 month ago #16253

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • Posts: 4616
  • Thank you received: 95

Replied by MEMO1DOMINION on topic Re: SHADOW CHRONICLES: PROFIT AND COST?

rtsurfer wrote:

MEMO1DOMINION wrote:

CORRECT. EVEN RICHARD EPCAR AFFIRM THAT THROUGH A CON ABOUT SIGNING ON TO 3 OTHER MOVIES BUT SCRAPPED AFTER THE WB DEAL.

What exactly did Richard Epcar say about the future of the other 3 SC saga movies, and what did he mean by "scrapped"?


AND


ps99041 wrote:

I guess we'll never get a real response to this question. It'd be nice if someone could post this question over at rt.com and see what the response is - probably an immediate ban followed by hearing how HG is fully committed to Robotech, there's sidequel coming, and LAM and SR in development.

ACTUALLY A FAN DID POST THIS RIGHT AFTER A CON IN RT.COM AND DON'T REMEMBER WHERE. WHAT THE POSTER SAID WAS THAT HG HAD TALKED TO RICHARD ABOUT A 3 MORE MOVIE PROJECTS BUT WAS CALLED BACK BY TOMMY TO LET HIM KNOW THINGS CHANGED DO TO HG WORKING WITH WB.

I am curious though about how much revenue could have been generated for HG if they had actually milked the success of SC with more merchandise (I know the wallet must be selling gangbusters) and a direct sequel as originally planned before the LAM deal.

I SUSPECT LESS THAN THE RLAM DEAL. THOSE MOVIE DEALS ARE BIGGER THAN GANGBUSTERS.

I guess interest may have been too low with Robotech at the time of SC for them to convince anyone to produce merchandise though we're in the situation today despite Robotech's popularity "rising" from the con tour.

YOU WOULD PRODUCE IF THERE BUYERS. RIGHT NOW WITH THE HIGH PRICES NOT SURE FANS WOULD OPEN THEIR WALLETS THAT EASY.

ps99041 wrote:

Regarding the triumvirate's total pay - if it's true that would explain why they haven't been fired despite any progress on the franchise. No one else would be willing to work for so little.

WE SAW TOM'S CHECK ONCE.. WE HAD A GOOD LAUGH BUT MAN, I GUESS NOW YOU KNOW WHY I WON'T WORK FOR HG. WILL HELP THEM AS A FAN AND SUPPORT ROBOTECH. BUT WOULD NEED MORE THAN DOUBLE TOMMY'S EARNINGS OF 2007 BEFORE I LEAVE MY JOB.

MY OPINION, I DON'T THINK TOMMY'S OR KEVIN EARNING IS THE SAME AS WHEN THEY SIGNED ON.
"IF IT DOESN'T EXIST...BUILD IT"
Last edit: 9 years 1 month ago by MEMO1DOMINION.
9 years 1 month ago #16254

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • ps99041
  • Visitor
  • Visitor

Replied by ps99041 on topic Re: SHADOW CHRONICLES: PROFIT AND COST?

There are always buyers of Robotech product so I don't know why you only say high prices are keeping product from being produced. Fans are constantly buying expensive Japanese imports by opening their wallets. Toynami has sold out of a bunch of 1/100 Valkyrie lines and they're only about $25. And look at Transformers where prices having gotten ridiculous over the past couple years yet still they sell well (don't get me started about Hasbro's questionable distribution though). Thus, the fact that there's so little merchandise from a project that sold gangbusters is most likely due to the fact that Robotech isn't a well known property (though HG will say otherwise) as well as HG probably demanding too much for licensing.
9 years 1 month ago #16261

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • rtsurfer
  • rtsurfer's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • REF Member
  • REF Member
  • Posts: 543
  • Thank you received: 0

Replied by rtsurfer on topic Re: SHADOW CHRONICLES: PROFIT AND COST?

ps99041 wrote:

There are always buyers of Robotech product so I don't know why you only say high prices are keeping product from being produced. Fans are constantly buying expensive Japanese imports by opening their wallets. Toynami has sold out of a bunch of 1/100 Valkyrie lines and they're only about $25. And look at Transformers where prices having gotten ridiculous over the past couple years yet still they sell well (don't get me started about Hasbro's questionable distribution though). Thus, the fact that there's so little merchandise from a project that sold gangbusters is most likely due to the fact that Robotech isn't a well known property (though HG will say otherwise) as well as HG probably demanding too much for licensing.

I agree, Robotech's non-competitors are cranking out new toy lines this year so I don't see how its the economy. It appears that consumers want inexpensive but detailed toys, not the overpriced collectables. If the actual production of Robotech toys is supposed to be based on demand then very few people apparently want Shadow Chronicle products, especially collectables.
I bet if someone conducted an independent, scientific, random survey the results would show that most people probably don't know what Robotech is and most of those who do recognize the name likely associate it with transforming jets and other 80's tv series.
As for licensing, we don't know how many renewals have occurred since Shadow Chronicles and what the going rate is. Sure, Warner Bros licensed the live action rights and is apparently snatching up the other available license. They must have made a killing off of it, right, but did HG receive a big payoff from the WB deal or are they accepting smaller amounts for options with the really big payoff to come if and when WBs use those rights? So we have no way of knowing if HG is sitting on a huge Robotech pile of money or if their Robotech division is hanging on for dear life.
"rtsurfer's two cent..." ;O)

rtsurfer's ROBOTECH archive
Last edit: 9 years 1 month ago by rtsurfer.
9 years 1 month ago #16265

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • blackconvoy_D01
  • blackconvoy_D01's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Veritech Fighter
  • Veritech Fighter
  • Posts: 289
  • Thank you received: 0

Replied by blackconvoy_D01 on topic Re: SHADOW CHRONICLES: PROFIT AND COST?

rtsurfer wrote:

ps99041 wrote:

There are always buyers of Robotech product so I don't know why you only say high prices are keeping product from being produced. Fans are constantly buying expensive Japanese imports by opening their wallets. Toynami has sold out of a bunch of 1/100 Valkyrie lines and they're only about $25. And look at Transformers where prices having gotten ridiculous over the past couple years yet still they sell well (don't get me started about Hasbro's questionable distribution though). Thus, the fact that there's so little merchandise from a project that sold gangbusters is most likely due to the fact that Robotech isn't a well known property (though HG will say otherwise) as well as HG probably demanding too much for licensing.

I agree, Robotech's non-competitors are cranking out new toy lines this year so I don't see how its the economy. It appears that consumers want inexpensive but detailed toys, not the overpriced collectables. If the actual production of Robotech toys is supposed to be based on demand then very few people apparently want Shadow Chronicle products, especially collectables.
I bet if someone conducted an independent, scientific, random survey the results would show that most people probably don't know what Robotech is and most of those who do recognize the name likely associate it with transforming jets and other 80's tv series.
As for licensing, we don't know how many renewals have occurred since Shadow Chronicles and what the going rate is. Sure, Warner Bros licensed the live action rights and is apparently snatching up the other available license. They must have made a killing off of it, right, but did HG receive a big payoff from the WB deal or are they accepting smaller amounts for options with the really big payoff to come if and when WBs use those rights? So we have no way of knowing if HG is sitting on a huge Robotech pile of money or if their Robotech division is hanging on for dear life.


I concur. For example. I've gotten over the course of the last two weeks:
-Macross Frontier- DX VF-25F Messiah with Tornado Pack
-Macross Frontier- Powered Parts for the Tornado Pack
-Macross Frontier- VF-25F Super Parts
-Macross Frontier- 2x Clear smoked DX Stands
-Macross Frontier- DX VF-25S Messiah with Armored Parts

The point: A portion could've gone into HG's pocket. But since they want to block Macross from US sale and distribution, unless they get some obnoxius ammount of percentages from sales, they loose out on this booty. Take this and multiply it by the masses, and it sucks to be HG.
My appreciation pics page:
www.flickr.com/photos/26350372@N04/
Last edit: 9 years 1 month ago by blackconvoy_D01.
9 years 1 month ago #16266

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Time to create page: 0.413 seconds